Watching the Planets - Burning the Bible?

This is why, while at least one person on this forum has taken Wayne's comments, video for Evil at concerts, and the lyrics to be a protest against animal experimentation, I think it's more nuanced than that. The question is what IS evil? Is it a human invention or is it natural fact of the universe? Is it inevitable or can we somehow dissolve our egos and connect not only with other humans but with all living beings, and someone coexist peacefully. I think it's far more sophisticated and curious than a PETA-style rant. Ultimately, this album is raising the question, not declaring an answer. In fact, it questions and perhaps even denies that an absolute objective answer exists!

Thank you for your kind words and for the feedback! I certainly have been pondering your words on silver trembling hands for awhile now and it certainly makes sense. Maybe "I can be a frog" also not only shows how we can be or do anything we want, but that is not limited to acting and behaving like animals or brutes capable competing and proving the fact that "people are evil its true" but then again "they decide." On another note, I'm sort of seeing how "see the leaves" tie into this whole concept of whether or not there is a spiritual world or afterlife etc. Obviously, the whimsical girl and rational and slightly pessimistic man are mentioned throughout most of the songs and this song enhances the discussion of being "convinced of the hex" believe that "life really has no end." At the same time, he sees it in a different way with the mindset of most people that all things have a beginning and end. "See the leaves, they're dying again etc" But is there end to everything? Certainly not the universe. Quite a rant I just wrote and I apologize for such a waste of time and space but I feel me and you are putting the pieces together of a fantastical puzzle that may hold a wonderful perspective behind life itself!

to me, this record seems to be the album that pretty much sums up Wayne's journey throughout the past 3 or 4 albums. ever since Zaireeka/Soft Bulletin era, Wayne's lyrics have become much more existential over time. The Soft Bulletin through At War seemed to be asking all the questions, while Embryonic seems to be Wayne at the end of his existential journey, finally coming around to an answer that suits him. It's an album not of questions but of exclamations and answers, at least from the songwriter's point of view I think. it's like he's found an answer to life, the universe and everything that he is content with. he's say okay here's my answer, you might not like it and its sure as hell not the happiest but its mine.

this is just my theory and is quite possibly wrong.

i think if you're looking for an album to ask questions with and find out what everything is all about for you, go back and listen to the soft bulletin and yoshimi and maybe at war.

stained glass windows keep the cold outside
while the hypocrites hide inside
with the lies of statues in their minds
where the christian religion made them blind
where they hide and pray to the god
of a bitch spelled backwards is dog
not for one race , one creed one world
but for money effective, absurd
do you pray to the holy ghost when you suck your host?
do you read whos dead in the Irish post?
do you give away the cash you cant afford?
on bended knees and pray to the lord
fat pig priest sanctimonious smiles
he takes the money you take the lies
this is religion and jesus christ
this is religion cheaply priced
this is bibles full of libel
this is sin in eternal hymn
this is what they done
this is your religion
the apostles were eleven
now theres a sod in heaven
this is religion
theres a liar on the altar
the sermon never faulter
this is religion
your religion!

Up until a year or so ago I had a longstanding hate towards Christianity for it's (non-taxed) grip on our political system, it's discrimination towards other religions, and it's use as justification for the crusades and the Native American genocide (Manifest Destiny). However religion is just a tool, like a hammer. Only its intended use is spiritual. But like any other tool it can be misused to hurt others, and that says more about the person wielding the tool than the tool itself.

By burning the bible in "Watching the Planets" we are getting rid of the old tools and searching for new ones. Modern Christianity has said that nature is evil, that it is apart from you, that God is apart from you, etc. Jesus came to say this is bullshit, God is within you, he's not something you have to search for, he is there, the eternal now. Not some point in the future, out of sight, after you die. Nature is not evil, we are part of nature, and God is in the sun and in the planet.

Watching the planets and the motion of the sun is something the ancient did obsessively, and like any ritual it puts your body and mind in sync with the forces that you engage. This song is a ritual, you can feel it from the very start. This is why that video works so well; to transcend, Wayne must shed his clothes (burning the exoteric bible) and journey INSIDE.

[quote=Mr. Modular]I mean, I can't imagine how a book that tells mankind that he should have dominion over all life on the entire planet might be so popular among its followers...

(All I'm sayin' is, look where that attitude has gotten us. People are just a little slow on the uptick...)[/quote

Haha could not agree more. This so called Bible as well was created by man. People like you and me. Just tripping on opium or something... And to follow something other than your own perception of things is ridiculous. That's why im not "convinced of the hex"

Well I do believe in me. But I do feel convinced that there may be some inexplicable reason as to how we came to be. Maybe I'm not a follower of the fallacies of organized religion and ritual brain washing but as to a power higher than us... maybe. And then again, maybe not. Maybe I am not supposed to every know such answers. But as a human, I am always tested and convinced of other hexes throughout the world. That's what makes us imperfect I suppose.

Oh my I must say thank you for this wonderful article you sent! I mean what a enlightening article of explosive knowledge. I loved how it begins with comparing our perception to ourselves with how gravity exists but we cannot fully describe it and then moves on and discusses the hemispheres of our brain and then even throws in some awesome empiricism and the use of our senses (of course mentioning the wonderful Hume which i even recently did a presentation on!) I mean wow if I wasn't convinced of the hex of the many fictional characters living within me and my novel of a world... I certainly am now. Even our own existence and justification of what we do cannot be rationalized it seems.

I really could not get over this part as well: (amazing wisdom)
"The chief fictional character at the center of that autobiography is one's self. And if you still want to know what the self really is, you're making a category mistake. After all, when a human being's behavioral control system becomes seriously impaired, it can turn out that the best hermeneutical story we can tell about that individual says that there is more than one character "inhabiting" that body. This is quite possible on the view of the self that I have been presenting; it does not require any fancy metaphysical miracles. One can discover multiple selves in a person just as unproblematically as one could find Early Young Rabbit and Late Young Rabbit in the imagined Updike novels: all that has to be the case is that the story doesn't cohere around one self, one imaginary point, but coheres (coheres much better, in any case) around two different imaginary points.
We sometimes encounter psychological disorders, or surgically created disunities, where the only way to interpret or make sense of them is to posit in effect two centers of gravity, two selves. One isn't creating or discovering a little bit of ghost stuff in doing that. One is simply creating another abstraction. It is an abstraction one uses as part of a theorical apparastus to understand, and predict, and make sense of, the behavior of some very complicated things. The fact that these abstract selves seem so robust and real is not surprising. They are much more complicated theoretical entities than a center of gravity. And remember that even a center of gravity has a fairly robust presence, once we start playing around with it. But no one has ever seen or ever will see a center of gravity. As David Hume noted, no one has ever seen a self, either."

I really must thank you for this enlightening experience! This has certainly changed my perception for the better. Haha who knows what kind of characters I have created throughout the years.

This switch doesn't even need to be between different bodies. Is there a seemless continuity of consciousness? How can the 'me' of 5 minutes/5 seconds from now possibly be the same me as now? Is it even possible to isolate an exact 'now' or is that a ridiculous thought?

When I was a little kid I would meditate on what I would be like when I was older, and wondering if I would be thinking about what I was like when I was younger. I created a similar experience of consciousness that I can connect back to at any time I want, yet it's baffling to think that person was me and is the same spirit/energy.

The song "Suddenly Everything Has Changed" feels like a good representation of these thoughts I have sometimes.

wow, i haven't seen a conversation like this in a LONG time on the lips board! very much enjoying this.

my interpretation of the "building the fire / burning the bible" lyric is that it conjures up a primal image in the listener's mind. that primal urge to throw shit on the fire — just to watch it burn.

As far as the purpose of the self, fear, etc., I think it's pretty clear how those have huge adaptive value from an evolutionary standpoint. Those creatures that look out for #1 are more likely to survive and reproduce, and you can't do that without a stable ego, i.e. sense of self vs. other. Similarly, fear is very very important as a motivator and learning tool. Much like pain. Think of those kids with insensitivity to pain (CIPA). Life is very dangerous for them because they constantly risk serious injury or death because they don't get the pain message that certain things are bad (like putting your hand on a hot stove, or falling and breaking bones). Fear likewise serves as a key motivator for avoidance (and some kinds of approach) behavior.

Of course, too much of a good thing can be bad. So for instance as social mammals we reap individual Darwinian fitness benefits from communication and cooperation, and that requires not being completely ego-bound. Having "theory of mind" (recognizing that others have their own separate thoughts and feeling) and empathy (the ability to experience similar thoughts and feeling by simulating their mental processes) are critical to effective social behavior. You can't do those things if you are too wrapped up in your own ego. Similarly, too much pain is a distraction, which is why your brain often blocks it following an injury so you can better flee or fight to deal with a threat. Fear of death, meanwhile, is very adaptive because it discourages you from letting it happen! But if it is too intense and pervasive then it just impairs your quality of life to no useful end. To combat that, I think it's useful to understand why we have those emotions in the first place, i.e. what adaptive purpose they serve and how they can sometime be maladaptive.

Alla

Alla

Doom sits in gloom in his room

Destroy the infidel

In a mosque - In a ghost - Is a sword - Is a Saracen

Alla

Joan of Arc was a sorcerer

The trilogy the desert sand

Scriptures in the tower of Babble

Alla

Only ending is easy

Burn - Burn - Burn

In the tower

Only ending is easy

Alla

Arise in the east

The trilogy

Alla

Alla

I take heed - Arise in the West.

A new crusade.

"And if God hears all my questions
well how come there's never an answer?
Is it nothin, nothin? "